Luke had to Quit his Favorite Game

he finally escaped from Tarkov

It's not about the developers making the game uncheatable because that's literally impossible, if they can build a wall someone else can break it down. It's about making a real effort to fight against cheating and accepting that if you want your competitive online game to survive you're going to have to fight this as hard as you can forever.

G0at uploaded an update video and I'm still giggling about a point he made in it.
He points out that the cheat creators actually advise that players running them uninstall Valorant and Vanguard because Vangaurd actually catches their cheats...
I found that utterly hilarious, Riots own anti cheat Vanguard for a totally different game is catching some of these cheats while on it's tea break 🤣
There was way more in it so well worth a watch 🤗

The radar hacks are even more insane. They run off a separate computer and read packets from your router to display a fully interactive map of everything on your 2nd PC. All the loot on the map, all the peoples real time location and direction, absolutely everything. It's insane. And no software is being run on the main PC.

The tarkov situation is so sad because I have nearly 2k hours in the game at this point and you get pretty good at telling when stuff is off. This wipe me and my friends all noticed how it was just so much more rampant. We realized how bad it was when we started on purpose looking away in fights and every time we would suddenly get pushed like clockwork. It was so consistent. We would use keys on rare loot rooms and more times than not it would be empty because someone sucked it all up. You would check the flea market and 50 graphics cards just up for sale in a bundle. It was too much and even though it was my most successful wipe it was also the most soulless and I quit

the best part is being called a cheater when you're not actually cheating. always makes my day.

In my opinion: You did NOT ruin g0at's video! You boosted it very well and explained what is in the video, without spoiling the video. Great Job! And extremely great job g0at!

I really love how when you mentioned the AK-74, someone immediately thought you just didn't know what an AK-47 is.

I’ve never played Tarkov and probably never will, but man Luke can tell a story here. That was pretty cool.

Bro he has genuinely over doubled his sub count, I love seeing this type of good in the world

I stopped playing tarkov about 6 months ago because I felt there were so many cheaters. My friends all thought I was crazy but the amount of times I would be in a fight or just moving around the map and have someone run up on our group silently and mow us down.

As a firearms enthusiast I find it cool to learn that about Luke.

It was nuts seeing Luke show up in g0at's video and everything he said about the problems with Tarkov are 100%. However I think there's something important that he left out (most likely because he wasn't aware) about Nikita, the project lead of Tarkov and the COO of BSG: he is on record saying that cheaters are good for business. His previous project was a F2P shooter riddled with MTX's and P2W stuff and he's talked about how constantly banning cheaters was good for a game because they'll "buy more copies". This is why nobody trusts BSG when they talk about cheaters.

This is why I miss servers with admins on it that was some random player. They could be toxic sure, but you can favorite servers that you liked. And most of them could view a player anytime during the match and kick them or ban them depending on the situation. It was like a forum administration of a small company that is a super fan of them doing it for free. Which in the gaming community happens very often when there is 100-1,000+ players. I never played Valorant as I heard even being AFK can get you banned/temp banned or even quitting in the middle of a match.

Considering that g0at's sub count went from 27k to over 60k in under a week after this WAN show, I think that you did well for g0at's channel and video haha.

The Green/Red box is often referred to as a Cham Hack (Chameleon) because it changes color according to "surroundings". We are with Luke 1000000%

"I am now deeply questioning every single engagement I ever have, win or lose doesn't matter"..... I can just imagine Luke getting so confused he gets killed and say's "that guy cheated" and then next game he gets a kill and his face goes confused and he starts thinking "omg what I have done, am I a cheater now?" 🤣

I feel you brother
I've left a few of my favourite games over the years because of cheating and now almost always play single player
One good thing about it is that you can play at your own pace, explore and take in small details that you miss. It's given me a different appreciation for games
Hopefully they figure something out about cheaters...

PVP games need to be fair, especially the appearance of it being fair and balanced. When it feels like there is no penalty for cheaters, then you lose all sense of enjoyment.

I feel the passion you have for the game … I’m new but do really love the core of the game but as a new player that struggles obviously the cheaters make it even more demoralizing

To hear luke say that, it hits home so much, Ive experienced this soul crushing experience

Cheaters are a large part of why I've been moving toward singleplayer and non-competitive experiences lately.

I'm so so so very sorry man. We will hope you get your time to grieve. :(

I've never identified with LInus more than with his take of how it feels to be a 'normie' playing EFT.

This sort of thing happened a ton in Dark Ages of Camelot back in the day, but we didn't have dedicated content creators exposing how bad it was, so we never knew exactly how bad it got. No one ever believed me, for instance, when I said I was keeping an eye on a warband from outside of render distance - while also being at the very edge of the zone and behind a tree - and then as soon as they got within render distance the whole warband turned on a dime and came straight for me. Up a hill, through a forest, around the huge tree I was behind and smashed me, then they returned to their original heading. (In DAoC you could zoom out REALLY far. Like almost all the way to render distance for objects.) After that, I questioned EVERYTHING, that happened. How much were people cheating? Was it just radar? What else were they doing? Had no way of knowing and very few people even agreed that it was possible.

Tarkov players: "Oh no, people are using wall hacks, I'm leaving the game."
GTA Online players: "I managed to play for 10 minutes without being harassed by a crowd of cheaters. Today was a good day."

It's nuts. I've had at least 5-10 instances where I knew that I had gotten within earshot without them hearing me, like they were sprinting while I was sneaking. I'd be trying to wait for them to leave. And then for no reason they come in my direction, a direction they realistically should have never gone, they walked straight up to me and mag dumped me... I was certain he was going to walk on by.
To be clear. I once had to take a phone call in the middle of a match on customs. I went prone in a bush on the side of old gas. I was on the phone for 10-20 minutes of the raid, I watched 6 players walk within 15 feet of me, and continued on, they had plain sight visuals of the bush I was laid prone in and not one shot me. I then went on to safely extract, and then to be on a map like woods, hiding in one of the thousands of bushes on the map, and then having a guy come straight to me and shoot me, it legitimately is a near 0 chance that they would have been able to identify me in a bush when being even decently stealthy.

The invisible player thing is interesting because it sounds like a moderator/admin function. Like something someone would use to monitor players for cheating without getting in the way of the game. Identical functions have been put in other online games for this exact reason. If for some reason that's the case, that there is some mod/admin privileges being given randomly to players, then it could be a pretty big security flaw.

It is now 20 years since I joined my first online game and I felt like I would be playing it for life at the time. It awoke all sorts of positive feelings in me. Cheaters were present from the start, but it was never anything too invasive; just some dope who would rather have his computer play the game for him, while he'd go pleasure himself to his favorite episode of Inuyasha or whatever, but after a little under 5 years, the bots were running the game. Entirely. It's a meme now, but it was "literally unplayable". It's so heartbreaking.

I feel your pain, because I've quit PVP games and prefer Co-Op/PVE games. P.S Dedicated Community Servers with admin tools would save this game, and how about mod tools to boot.

God, everytime I listen to his thought process of questionable deaths in tarkov, it’s like it’s me talking

Ive been having a great time in single player tarkov, install a few mods on top of it, and my love for tarkov is back.

Some of the LTT content is so good I feel guilty that I thumbed up other videos that are not on par. Thank you!

I'm with Luke on getting drawn in with the firearm customization and accuracy is top-notch compared to so many other games.

Honestly I thought that I was just experiencing horrible desync and server issues playing that game. Those made me want to never play it until they fixed the servers. Now, after watching g0at's video, I know it's extremely likely that those weird and suspect deaths were cheaters, and I have even less incentive to play it.

i've said this for years. It is easy to detect cheaters when they are being blatant, but almost impossible if they try to play legitimate. And if a game won't ban the obvious cheaters, how on earth will it detect the sneaky ones?

I watched his video yesterday and even though I've never played Tarkov, it was very eye opening to see just how bad cheating is!!

Thanks for shedding light on the cheating issue, please do a video investigating the topic and meeting with experts to help game developers with ways to prevent it.

I also did a lot of breaks over the years while playing tarkov, not only because my hardware isnt the best or it can be insanely stressful, but I always felt like everyone is either cheating or completely cracked at the game. They really need a replay system so i can at least figure out what I can do to get better or if the guy was just cheating.

The downside to game streaming as a counter measure to cheating, is it would drastically increase the bandwidth requirements to play online, increasing the bar for entry past what some (maybe a most if my friend groups are much to go by) players have access to in their area.

Seeing Luke completely gush about Tarkov and having to quit is quite sad

I always feel like when players do that with games is to basically kill it from the inside and pushing the devs to fix stuff, from what I'm hearing is that Tarkov basically need an Overwatch system just like CSGO and a heavy anti cheat system

I'd say an acceptable level of cheating in multiplayer games is any amount low enough that it feels like a rare occurrence to run into a cheater, and that most people's default reaction to someone claiming to have been owned by a cheater is just "no, they were probably just better than you".

Honestly I feel sorry for those that still play without cheating. This wipe has felt bad as ever but honestly it's been this way for a lot longer than this. They just feel empowered I mean when you have cheats that have gone undetected for 2 years either bsg is the making them or bsg doesn't care.

This is why I'm playing the single player Tarkov AKI mod. Been loving it.

I remember a video from the late 90s where a cheater was caught at a LAN and they not only kicked him out, they threw his computer into the parking lot after him.

I feel the same Luke. Played Tarkov for several years, around 3K hours. I quit it completely now because of the the cheaters BUT also because of BSG REALLY SHITTY actions and behavior!!

Luke's conclusion is the same as mine but back when I played Starcraft 1 and Counterstrike 1.6. Back then, it was real common to see cheaters in seemingly every game using obvious means but with no way from my point of view to combat it. From my memory, Starcraft 1 cheaters would use invincible cheap units (zerglings and marines for example) and Counterstrike 1.6 cheaters would use obvious aimbots (aim snapping and 100% perfect recoil/bullet spread). Those were ones I could detect just from playing the game. It's why I nowadays don't really pay attention to competitive online games presently because the chance of getting a fair match is just way too low. I share your pain Luke.

I’ve only came across one rage hacker in Labs and it was my first raid in labs. Watching g0at’s video opened my eyes from all my coping in EFT. I usually place top 10% of most shooter game I play and I love the challenge that EFT brings. I don’t mind dying and losing in EFT, but when the deaths are too sketch and you start questioning and coping, it ain’t fun no more.

Goat's video is good. As a non-tarkov player, i felt it watching it. Cheating is rampant in every single multiplayer game.

those last few lines you could really feel how deeply it hurt :(

I started playing tarkov a few years ago, and have also quit (2 wipes ago-ish). The cheater problem got progressively worse very quickly. It used to be fairly rare, 1 out of 50 raids you'd die in a sketchy way.
My theory is that, after the game blew up with twitch drops etc etc, the RMT market really came to life. This incentivized more people to cheat. Labs became unplayable, since it was the highest value map by far, naturally pulling cheaters in for the best return on their time. Then, with a few changes, they started to spread out to other maps.
I think over time, people started to cheat to counter cheaters. And now we're here. In comparison with every other FPS game I've played for the past 15ish years, I maybe questioned my death ~1% of the time or less. With tarkov, it unironically feels like 1/5 deaths are sketchy enough to question the other players legitimacy, which just causes pent up frustration due to the uncertainty and the massive time loss that each death brings. I could deal with BR's having a cheater every 5 matches, but in tarkov? Where you sink 3hrs of your life into the game just to buy 1 gear set and then all of that ends in you getting 1 tapped by a cheater? Nah, pass.

I remember back in the day when the original MW2 came out, there were some cheaters but it wasn't enough to ruin the game for me. Then the next game came out and MW2 just got flooded with cheaters. It was fun at first since some of the hacked lobbies were custom game modes and low gravity, but it got to a point where every single match someone had a UAV cheat and made it impossible to have fun unless you were cheating as well. At a certain point, if you let the cheaters get out of hand, there is no going back.

I kinda love how the futher along we move in the gaming space, the best ways to fix issues is either the old school LAN option or the hyper expensive route of streaming only

I'm on my 3rd wipe, and I love this game (setting my loadout now, getting ready to solo rat around woods looking for that damn sledgehammer). I'm a lucky case, haven't 'seen' an invisible player or flying player, but watched G0ats video (and many of the other videos supporting or being triggered by it) and can think of a few instances where I probably got 'ESP'd. I record my games, and go back to scrutinize my deaths and successful engagements to try and get gud. More than half the time I never saw someone, watching again i can see a muzzle flash in a bush, or something. It's disheartening to think about all the cheating, but after playing games on PC since before the NES even released, and playing some HARD games, NOTHING has challenged me like this brutal insane game. It made me basically drop a 15 year wow addiction because, as a no-longer raiding casual, that game was a simple faceroll and every second of Tarkov, you need to be on your game (99% solo player). I'm sad you decided to stop for now, and hope things can be done about cheating. Love the WAN show guys, and although it's a 'negative' subject, it was very exciting to watch you guys go in depth talking about Tarkov!

What's surprising to me about this is that it has been known for YEARS that every match in Tarkov has cheaters. There was a guy who went on Reddit a while back and came clean about cheating and revealed this information. There was always someone in the lobby with some form of cheat according to them. They had a whole spreadsheet of their raids and how many cheaters were in each one if I remember correctly

Dude, this wipe, with all the stuff going on, I decided that I was only gonna scav it for a bit. But, I’ve discovered how much of the game you can accomplish without doing a single pmc run, so now it’s become a challenge to see how far I can take my pmc without playing as one.
I’ve got pretty much all the level 1 hideout stuff. I’m one metal scissors away from having the gym built. My pmc is already at lvl 4, probably about 800xp away from five. I will admit, this is probably as far as I’ll be able to level, without doing a pmc run. I’ve got every item needed for fetch quests between lvl 1-20. Not bad from a bunch of 2 min factory scav runs.

Bro from watching this video I'm both super interested in tarkov - deep gun customisation and player health with missions and loot and high tension sounds super fun. What doesn't sound fun just dying to hackers, which seems to be inevitable.

So basically, you won the game...you have escaped finally.

I feel ya bro. I quit warzone for the same reason. I loved it and it kills me that i had to. Cheating is too rampant.

I heard in Japan they make you register with your real ID before making an account in a Multiplayer online game and you get fine if you are caught cheating, I don’t think it will completely solve the issue in the US but it might help

You guys should have these creators call in or something. Would be cool to hear from them

Luke, I think your input was genuine and really resonated with me inside of g0at's video. Thank you for taking time out of your day to contribute to the EFT discussion, especially with cheaters

one thing that could work if we are addressing a separate system for gaming is a vfio kvm gaming virtual machine I use it for playing games that use anticheat software of kernel level drivers even and has been working sorta fine, aside from some small performance issues it was fine I can play forza horizon 5 at 1080p with a mix of high and ultra settings with raytracing on high just fine, so you could look into that, but that would require a linux machine that is based on arch to make it easier
edit: need to mention this, my VM uses gpu pass-through with a rtx 3060 ti and utilizes a linux hypervisor and is contained inside of hyper-v making it harder to cheat and more secure as a result

Even if they 100% stopped cheating tomorrow, the desync issues would still make you feel like you're getting hacked on. Both need to get fixed to make any progress.

I had to do the same thing. Every game seems to be filled with cheaters sadly, if you cant play just get good and don't cheat.

Luke, Bro. I love you even more. EfT is an awesome game. But not yet. Stay strong brother 🙌🏻🙌🏻🙌🏻

I actually picked Tarkov back up right now and havent had any clear interactions. I thought maybe the cheaters might lay low while theres a lot of heat on this. Of course starting well into wipe massively blows

I've come back after the whole goat thing. Feels so much better w/o the cheaters. I'm a "chad" been playing 5 yrs. Started feeling like I was loosing my edge. Now with the bans and arrests I've loss like 2/20 non game bug fights. Felt solid, good voip, no laser beams, pre fires etc. Feels real good rn

If you're in a resort, you don't hear people walking around above you. Yet in Tarkov, people on the roof sound like they're next to the floor 1 Timmy

Imagine playing Tarkov and running into Linus and Luke 🤣

It's time for Luke to get into Hunt: Showdown now

1:15 WOW, that actually makes me want to play this just for a bit despite the hackers.

Cheating in games has been a problem for a long time and it does feel like the only thing you can do is not play. Which is what I ended up doing. I gave up on the multiplayer community. There are many chill players out there, but the cheaters just ruined it for me. There is no game where they aren't cheating.

We need a lot of people to watch this clip. Exposure at the largest possible scale is the ONLY thing that will get BSG/Nikita off their 🍑 and either fix it, or finally just say they’re not going to do anything and let us know.

Nice work pulling up his channel stats - it's impressive to see your video boost his subs in real time :) Tarkov sounds like GTAV online O-o

Bro I hope there’s a day I can play without regularly losing to cheaters

The cheating is was made me stop trying to even pick up tarkov. None of my friends play it so I was essentially learning the game solo, but the amount of times I died to obvious cheaters was insane. So I just quit, less than 30 hours into the game and I had to quit cause of cheaters.
Edit: based on the number of people commenting about how I probably haven’t been killed by cheaters but rather just good players I can firmly say that although most of my time in game was fine I can say with certainty that I’ve been killed by cheaters a few times. The reason I pointed out the amount of hours I’ve played wasn’t meant as a “ I have lots of hours in the game.” More so, that I quit less than 30 hours in because of the amount of times I’ve died to cheaters. Believe me, I have hundreds if not close to a thousand hours in other tactical/survival and fps shooters. Games that are similar and completely different to Tarkov like DayZ, The Cycle: Frontier, Valorant, CSGO and Apex. I don’t deny that Tarkov is a completely different to other games and has a big learning curve (which I love) but I wouldn’t go so far as to say that I’m being ignorant or jumping to conclusions by saying I’ve died multiple times to cheaters.
I wasn’t dying to cheaters every other game or so often but I had a minimum of 10 runs or so of dying to people I could visually see “speed” hacking. I’m not ignorant to peoples tactics in this game as I’ve seen many streamers play it, which is what got me into the game in the first place.

I watch a lot of Rust streamers and the situation in there is also pretty dismal. The worst thing is it's usually on a server-by-server basis so if the cheaters aren't playing on official servers their account doesn't get banned.

Really curious to see how AI can be applied to anti-cheats, detecting cheater behaviour rather than cheating software

I run a small tight-knit gaming community that always focused on playing CSGO, and with the ease of cheating in the game we always had a very strict no cheating rule.
If you were caught cheating (and when suspicious we would review the games we played with them), we would ban you from the server, regardless of how nice you were as a person. The shame and being shunned socially really affected these people and after a year or two we would allow a second chance with scrutiny. This system, similar to the LAN party suggestion works well on a personal scale.

best way to deal with cheaters is to make sure that the computer does not have unnecessary information in memory

I'm in the same boat, over 6 years of Tarkov and I am done for now for the same reasons

I remember all the meme's from Tarkov mocking CoD's cheating situation. lol. I told them that it doesn't matter WHICH game it is or which DEV, that if the game was famous enough, cheaters will break it. lol. I think we need more of these fake bait cheats that not only mess with cheaters "hacks" but also fuck up cheaters computers.

linus, I think we need a badminton tournament between your staffs
let them train for a few months
and I really wanna see him destroying everyone with badminton ..

the LAN party suggestion is basically how Ultimate Frisbee works, and like it's pretty solid, shitters are everywhere but community matters so much, and is chronically underrated.

I'm greatly interested in seeing them combat cheaters but I also worry about game devs using this as an opportunity to ban a lot of innocents in the crossfire.
And worse, this has an incentive for them to do so as often people will return by purchasing the game again. (Which means more money for the game company)
I seriously worry this might turn into a nightmare. And BSG is too focused on small time RMT traders, they've already banned a few people for just merely sharing accounts I know about. One of my buddies shared his account with a good friend of his in another country and just a few days later his account gets banned. If you go vacationing with a different PC too often you might get banned yourself.
This is just one example of over-banning.
IMO bans need to be *almost* entirely focused against cheaters who use walls or aim, everything else shouldn't be a priority. I personally think BSG is mostly targeting the low-tier RMT people for bans as a means of further profiting from banning people.
The economic dynamics of bans are truly horrifying when you consider BSG may be simply banning people only after they've cheated for a while (long enough to have their fun for their money's worth) so they'll keep returning and buying the game again.

Same. I haven't played after 5 raids this wipe. The sound, the memory leaks, the jitter, the net code, the cheaters make it not worth it right now.
Post raid replay is the only thing that will save the game. This is easy to implement with a raid log and the offline engine already implemented in Tarkov.

"If there's a multiplayer game, there's going to be at least someone who's going to find an unfair advantage"
Unless it's that game you just lost.

Dude, I miss LAN gaming. I played LAN parties pretty consistently from my teen years until nearly 30, and even a few times after that.

Linus is always an accident waiting to happen. 🤣

I've wanted to play Tarkov for a long time, finally got a new machine built, and now G0at's video comes out and tells me there's no point to buy the game.

No seriously I listened to the video today and this would of hyped it, it was excellent content.

Luke nailed it. I felt a change around .12, never went back. I feel like the game was a victim of its own success in a way, and for sure has suffered severe scope creep as a project with the resources BSG has. At least it popularized a "new" genre. I support Goat and his idea to show how bad it really is currently.

I was invited to Tarkov by some friends, they were openly, blatantly cheating, everyone else they were playing against were also cheating the same way, they had map hacks, which showed where everyone was, and watching it, I saw that every single player was looking directly at other players through walls, which I guess makes it fair, no one's cheating if everyone is, cause then it's equal again, but I just stopped playing, I had less than 20 hours in game, but that just killed my will to play, forever.

Hey Luke, if you want some Tarkov fix without the hassle, try the singleplayer mod. ;)
Not quite the same, as there's no human players, but you can faff about with the game much more.

My heart dropped when in G0ats video the cheater wiggles back. At that moment I knew Tarkov was in a bad place like it never has been. I've been playing since 2017 and it's never been this bad and noticeable it was blatant cheating.

At old school PDX lans it was in the agreement you signed that if you cheated you could not sue when they threw you out and literally threw your PC out the door destroying it on the pavement. Dunno how legal it actually was but they got away with it for a while at least.

It absolutely destroys the competitive spirit and should be treated as a number one priority.
But honestly it's the kind of thing that you either take in stride or you just stop playing. Depends on the game and the man. I've had a lot of really good memories punking cheaters in my favorite games because no amount of aimbot can make you not a bot. But on the flip side of that same coin I've totally abandoned games I was passionate about because of rampant cheaters.
If your passionate about something cheating hurts you so much more. The soul damage is increased perpetually by how invested you are in the the game and how much a cheater can take away by screwing you.

I've also quit. Got to level 41 and I feel like I've got into a really bad situation whereby I think everyone is cheating when I get killed. Obviously that's not true, but it's just not good to be in this mindset and it's impossible to get out of it after Goats video to he honest.